[APP] - version 4.9.+ ( 04/2022 )

Started by Menion, April 25, 2022, 16:11:17

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CabrioTourer

Quote from: Andrew Heard on April 27, 2022, 08:16:36
Quote from: CabrioTourer on April 26, 2022, 22:34:39
Interesting new feature to generate shaping points in planner for imported tracks.

I guess it's difficult to find a balance between to many or not enough points.
@CabrioTourer - check out how http://brouter.de/brouter-web allows total user control of balance of points - Load > Load Track as Route > Tuning > Fuzziness slider control - one side very few shaping points, other side of slider - lots of shaping points - no need for system to compromise because user decides - very nice system IMHO.


I'm not sure that I understand what you mean.
Shaping points in my example were created by Locus when I imported a track. . The gpx comes from kurviger.de

The problem I see is that Locus creates the points just by guessing. Without taking the router logic into account the user will use later.
Or at least this is what I assume how it works from my findings. Correct me if I'm wrong.

So with this feauture I have no control where and how many shaping points are created.

I just have the fact that even without any change in shaping points position a recalculate will create different route with many stupid things.
Recalc is the worst case ofc.
The same will happen for a part of the route whenever I move a shaping point or later during navigation when Locus needs to recalculate partialy.


For me such a feature would be a dream. Today I always need to use the route planner manually to create a route which will follow the exact same path as defined by an external gpx.

Maybe I completely misunderstand the usage of this feauture.




0709

#16
After importing the gpx into the route planner, some attached Shaping Points are now automatically offered in the Locus route planner.  I had a first test...sure works pretty nice usefull.

- By the way, you can also set Via Points as the default in the Locus route planner Settings.
- Only Turn and Via points lead to navigation alerts and give distance values @ navigation.


The planner point placement is random. It's hard to do otherwise since the (recorded) import track NOW is not yet matched with the BRouter osm data.
That will come later and that is precisely the final task that you want to accomplish by using the route planner.

The advantage is, if you now reposition one of the shaping points or create an additional one, you will not suddenly change the entire track loop (based on the imported track) total unexpectedly.
In short, you will only change a small segment at a time, possibly still drastically and unexpectedly ;-)
These unexpected larger deviations are of course also influenced by the selected Brouter routing profile in use. Select this as correctly as possible according to you expected usage.

Now it concerns only a small segment piece and so you have better control of it to produce your route as an "osm map matched track" slowly but controlled this segment by segment.
If you have the original track import then also presented in a different color then you have a perfect guide to accomplish this task quite comfortably.

I see that you also briefly mentioned Kurviger.

In Locus, the Shaping Points are only used as route reference points during the production of a map matched track route traject.
Once in the navigation and also by means of the gpx transfers this useful info is completely neglected and thus almost completely lost.
There is still a residual associated track point left but this is hardly reflected or found in the very large numbers of track points.
If you then also use Locus autorouting to point in the navigation, the useful shaping points are also not available anymore as point targets.

The big difference with the (imo) superior Kurviger results are therefore as follows:

Both the Via Points and the Shaping Points are neatly stored in the navigation as well as in the .kurviger file transfers.
In Kurviger the Via Points AND the Shaping Points are both planner router references as well as Targets in the navigation.
The autorecalculation in Kurviger is always directed to either a Via or a Shaping Point. Ready and clear known targets.

The difference is this.
A Via Point is announced in navigation both by audio TTS as well as visually.
A Shaping Point (= a muted Via Point) is therefore NOT announced.
Promoting a neatly kept Shaping Point to Via Point or vice versa is so very simple
Locus Pro 3.59.0

freischneider

Import track into route planner:
I think there has been a lot of discussion in this proposal.
https://help.locusmap.eu/topic/navigation-from-track
If Locus sets the shaping point every 500m (or 200m adjustable). Exactly in the order the track runs.
And if there is a crossing in the distance of x meters. Then Locus sets the point not exactly at 500 meters, but x meters after the intersection.
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0709

#18
QuoteAnd if there is a crossing in the distance of x meters. Then Locus sets the point not exactly at 500 meters, but x meters after the intersection.
How can Locus known there is a crossing before the creation of the new map matched track/route ?
First you can just accept that there is or will be mistakes. This by a trackglitch and thereby creates false instructions and a correcting U-turn. Notice the U-turns are positioned on the exact same location spot as the now map matched Planner (Via or Shaping) resulting trackpoint.
Be happy, so just let it happen. As you the user will be warned immediately ! These trackglitches are now nicely INDICATED by the Locus trackglitch detector tool. (Red circle)
What to do ?
Find the Route planner Point (Via or Shaping) and move this into a favarouble position further on the expected road direction or path, and so the indicator gets cleared now, and also the result will be fine.  (Yes the final correction is so still to do by some human planner operator interaction)
Locus Pro 3.59.0

Andrew Heard

Quote from: CabrioTourer on April 27, 2022, 15:59:13
The problem I see is that Locus creates the points just by guessing.
@CabrioTourer - agree; but still better than no points

QuoteSo with this feauture I have no control where and how many shaping points are created.
agree; Brouter - no control over where, but at least allows you to decide on show many

how could an app make an intelligent decision where to place auto-shaping-points?

Quote from: CabrioTourer on April 27, 2022, 15:59:13
Maybe I completely misunderstand the usage of this feauture.
I think you understand correctly, well same as my understanding at least

as @0709 says many times, preserving the shaping points within any exported/ imported GPX would be a worthwhile improvement too
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joeloc

Quote from: Menion on April 26, 2022, 08:41:29
@joeloc
thanks for the logs related to the app killing. These are logs directly made by Locus Map right? They are useful for some debugging and testing tasks, but in case, the system kills the app, the app has no chance (no time) to write any info about this crash into these logs. So in case, we try to debug some "crash", it is necessary to create a system log which should be! everything.

Ok, will do a system log next time. Shouldn't be too long, Locus died twice today already. 30MB zipped is a lot though... Samsung/Google really put a lot in there.

Did you find out why Locus retries live tracking every second when offline? Doesnt this prevent device sleep and all other good battery saving things? I usually go airplane mode when I need to save battery, this works nicely to shut up all social media crap. But if it makes Locus use more power than less, I have to reconsider this tactic :-)

Btw, thanks for max scale setting per map. Works fine and makes Overlay-Heatmap-Life a lot better.
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Tapio

#21
Route Planner. I think the most common thing is inserting shaping points somewhere into a track- and this is a bit too hidden. First we have to go to the three dot submenu, pick "Trackpoint XY", then convert it.

I understand there's the same logic here as on tracks. You toggle between track segment and trackpoint.

The toggling to trackpoint should be bettom left, just like in normal track window. See screenshot - there could be a button "Trackpoint XY". That's my idea. Would follow the same logic as the track window.

Not following the logic, but ultra super mega convenient would be, if all three trackpoint commands ("Change to") were already visible in the orange screenshot area. Because why not - after toggling, the trackpoint screen additionally includes only Help and Streetview. Both are also available in the "Route segment" view. So you could unify and simplify it.
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Andrew Heard

Totally agree converting/ promoting an ordinary track point to a Shaping or Via point is unnecessarily tedious at present. It's a very common use case. But we've had this discussion before right ;-(
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Tapio

Quote from: Andrew Heard on April 29, 2022, 01:26:46
Totally agree converting/ promoting an ordinary track point to a Shaping or Via point is unnecessarily tedious at present. It's a very common use case. But we've had this discussion before right ;-(
Did we? Probably without Menion, because I feel he'd instantly agree 😁
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Menion

#24
@tapio@slarti76
PiP display: it is possible that panel ratio affects resize options. Anyway, this panel was made mainly for navigation. For this case it is optimized and because of this, it is a little higher. I do not see a sense to increase its size close to the full-screen.

Automatic zoom & rotation works for me as well as no glitches as balloni55 wrote above. Sorry, there is not much I may do for now.

Text-to-speech: I did no changes here and also did not noticed any "reset", sorry.

@CabrioTourer
When you create a route in any other web planner, then why do you need to "recalculate" it in the app?

I do not understand what magic you all search here. This small improvement should really help to more easily modify recorded tracks without worry, the whole track will be re-computed. Do not search for something more robust behind this.

Btw. points are not placed randomly! App firstly heavily simplifies track shape, thanks to this detect some places where the shape of the track change a lot and place point there.

Ah, I see, Willy nicely described it here, thanks.

@joeloc
Live-tracking > internally live tracking is close to track recording service. App simply collects data in defined internal and sends them when possible. Live-tracking is running as a service so it keeps the device awake. Use it as is as currently there is no time for a major update.

@tapio
quick change to via/shaping etc ... hmm. I instantly agree  :D ... just do it...
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slarti76

#25
Quote from: Menion on April 29, 2022, 09:56:31
@tapio
I think you meant me ;)

Quote from: Menion on April 29, 2022, 09:56:31PiP display: it is possible that panel ratio affects resize options. Anyway, this panel was made mainly for navigation. For this case it is optimized and because of this, it is a little higher. I do not see a sense to increase its size close to the full-screen.
No, I agreed, fullscreen makes no sense. But look at my screenshot: Imagine this in >50cm distance while biking, that is basically pointless! Perhaps this is something Samsung-y and not like that on your phone. But for me, it's now useless, whereas in the initial beta I could at least get it to ca. double the width, which makes it usable.
Please add an option to choose ratio (e.g. 3:2, 1:1, 2:3 is enough)!

Quote from: Menion on April 29, 2022, 09:56:31Automatic zoom & rotation works for me as well as no glitches as balloni55 wrote above. Sorry, there is not much I may do for now.
Ok, will check automatic zoom again, didn't get around to check it with release version. Rotation works, I can confirm.
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CabrioTourer

Quote from: 0709 on April 27, 2022, 17:37:44
.As you the user will be warned immediately ! These trackglitches are now nicely INDICATED by the Locus trackglitch detector tool. (Red circle)

I think I missed something important. How works the "trackglitch detector" ?

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CabrioTourer

Quote from: Menion on April 29, 2022, 09:56:31
@CabrioTourer
When you create a route in any other web planner, then why do you need to "recalculate" it in the app?

I'm one of the guide's for Tours which has up to 30 participants. The group is splitted in smaller ones, each is leaded by a guide like me.

The organizer of the tour plans the route with whatever tool. Kurviger in this case. He exports the gpx for the guide's upfront.

Because I find it much easier to have navigation commands just when needed, I replan the gpx with Locus.

Btw: That's just a minor usage of Locus for me.
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Tapio

#28
I hate to say that, but that is not an improvement. It's rather indicating that you want to keep the unnecessary sub-window 🙄

EDIT: No, it is an improvement! Before there was a menu appearing.
IMO it would be clearer to understand, if it was accessible via a button bottom left. Like "TP 351", "EDIT Trackpoint"... idk exactly.

Is there a reason why you don't put all on one screen? Faster workflow.
Currently there is no toggle back to segment window.
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0709

#29
Quote from: CabrioTourer on April 29, 2022, 20:23:14
I think I missed something important. How works the "trackglitch detector" ?

https://t.ly/3M6e
Notice:  NEVER place the shaping points on intersections!
There is not much publicity given to this nevertheless useful tool.
It works best with these track files as are produced by  BRouter.

https://t.ly/ULDC
Locus Pro 3.59.0
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