Navigation on all tracks

Sersus · December 30, 2013, 18:54:04

First I have to say that I am very impressed with this new function! It was a long waited option to ride on bicycle within the previously recorded random (or borrowed other) track with the voice prompts.
So after some testing with random tracks I have two rationalization suggestions.

1. I think its a good idea to voice the distance to the next driving maneuver provided that the distance to it is more than 1 kilometer. I have to explain this. When riding with the phone in the pocket, after the another turn you dont know how many kilometers you have to go further. So for example riding half an hour with silence you mentally start to worry about the program itself (it may crash) or phone itself or any other shit can happen! BUT when you know exactly that you must ride forward for 5,5 kilometers you can just relax and pedaling. ))) Just say "Keep moving more than 5 kilometers".

2. Recorded tracks often have the errors or unnecessary movements on the spot.

I think it would be a good thing for the algorithm to ignore the small track inaccuracy within 20-30 meters. I.E. if the radius of the some maneuvers is within the range of 20-30 meters and after them the direction of the route is still the same - there is no need to specify maneuvers.

The voice guiding will be confusing in such case.
Or in general if the track has more than one maneuver (change of the directions) within the range of 20-30 meters it would be logical to only take into account the last waypoint where the direction is changing.
For example in this case we have not the true left turn but "take the left" only.

tommi · December 30, 2013, 20:25:42

Quote from: Sersus on December 30, 2013, 18:54:04
First I have to say that I am very impressed with this new function! It was a long waited option to ride on bicycle within the previously recorded random (or borrowed other) track with the voice prompts.
So after some testing with random tracks I have two rationalization suggestions.

Thank you for your detailled review, suggestions are always welcome.

Quote from: Sersus
1. I think its a good idea to voice the distance to the next driving maneuver provided that the distance to it is more than 1 kilometer. I have to explain this. When riding with the phone in the pocket, after the another turn you dont know how many kilometers you have to go further. So for example riding half an hour with silence you mentally start to worry about the program itself (it may crash) or phone itself or any other shit can happen! BUT when you know exactly that you must ride forward for 5,5 kilometers you can just relax and pedaling. ))) Just say "Keep moving more than 5 kilometers".

So your suggestion is to add an additional instruction in case there is a long distance to the next turn. Fully agreed.
In case you get off track the off-track notification should help you but you are right, empty battery, crashed phone, pulled off plug from the phone, etc. are things which may worry the user. We should keep in mind that there shouldn't be awful lot of TTS hints because this becomes annoying after some time. But just one more after the last turn before a long straight part of the track should be ok. I'm not sure when the first announcement for the next turn comes but the new one should only be inserted in case the distance is much longer than the distance for the first announcement

Quote from: Sersus

2. Recorded tracks often have the errors or unnecessary movements on the spot.

I think it would be a good thing for the algorithm to ignore the small track inaccuracy within 20-30 meters. I.E. if the radius of the some maneuvers is within the range of 20-30 meters and after them the direction of the route is still the same - there is no need to specify maneuvers.

The voice guiding will be confusing in such case.
Or in general if the track has more than one maneuver (change of the directions) within the range of 20-30 meters it would be logical to only take into account the last waypoint where the direction is changing.
For example in this case we have not the true left turn but "take the left" only.

What setting did you choose for your navigation? I guess "Number of orders = High". Try with Medium (you can do it from the sofa, no need to do the >100km ride again) for the critical situations.
Maybe I should explain what this "Number of orders" actually means. The setting is not to let the TTS talk and talk and talk. The idea is to configure (and my proposal for this setting is still "minimum expected distance between turns". "Number of orders = High" is I think equivalent to "Minimum expected distance between turns = 20m". I don't know the equivalent for medium and low, Menion should tell us.
I could imagine that 40m or 50m would be ideal in your case. Keep in mind that the algorithm for "Navigation on all tracks" is without any knowledge of roads, it only knows the track and it doesn't know why there is a turn in the track.

Why is high equivalent to 20m nevertheless useful? People also use accurate tracks, e.g. calculated by brouter (c.f. http://forum.locusmap.eu/index.php?topic=3434 for details) and if you e.g. take a ride through a village not following the main road it happens quite often that there is a sequence of two turns like a zig-zag with a distance of e.g. 15-40m. The setting medium as well as your proposal will not detect this zig-zag.

druki · March 13, 2014, 00:36:34

Last weekend in deepest bavaria without mobile network, I needed brouter with Navigation beta again and like to show you the curious time to drive 142km...

Menion · March 13, 2014, 14:44:56

hello druki, looks like looong trip

Anyway hard to say what cause this.

May you please write me:
- source of track (how you computed this)?
- was such nonsense visible all the time on some straight parts or just during some break? (then it's possible, because your speed was at this moment really very low).

druki · March 14, 2014, 01:28:44

Source was brouter in car mode.
Navigation beta was always in real GPS mode and the speed of 116 km/h is correct (on higway i had the chance to make the screenshot without big danger).
At the next filling station I was back in mobile network, used Mapsforge and real navigation and it was perfect.
I think, the bug is in beta navigation regardless which source. I will test this soon by following a handmate track (without and routing service for computing the track).

Menion · March 14, 2014, 07:46:37

I think this won't be a problem of BRouter. I was asking mainly because when you compute route online, there are some estimated times I use. Anyway in BRouter as well as imported track, these times aren't, so there is need to compute required times in any way. And here is probably problem on such loong track ...

Joachim Buhl · April 06, 2014, 12:31:55

Hallo All

Winter is over, New routes have to be planned.
Today i recognized, that planning a route with mapquest doesn't return "visible" turn instructions anymore. Since when was that changed? Are they still produced but not showed anymore? So now you cannot check if there are all needed instructions. Because often Mapquest miss to create some.
I also read, that there is a new feature. Something like TTS for waypoints? Where can I find this feature?
What does it do? Does it read a text saved in a waypoint, when I reach a certain distance to the point?
This would be perfect to add turn instructions, where Mapquest missed some. But this I cannot see, because.....see above...the circle closes ;-)

Thanks

druki · April 06, 2014, 13:48:46

Hi Joachim, I think you mixed it a bit, see first post of this threat and http://support.locusmap.eu/hc/en-us/articles/200197661-Types-of-navigation . Navigation (computed by an external service): http://support.locusmap.eu/hc/en-us/articles/200106731-Navigate-To . Guiding to waypoints and notifications about this is something different: http://support.locusmap.eu/hc/en-us/articles/200118982-Notification-view . To see the settings for notification, click in Locus settings "Routenführung (Guiding)" on the word "Benachrichtigung" (in German) left to the switch.

Menion · April 06, 2014, 13:52:21

Ah Joachim is partially right ...

I was looking on generated tracks by "Add new route" feature and was still looking that there is missing something. And it was icons with navigation orders

. Thank you Joachim, I'll fix it to next version.

About TTS to waypoints - this was introduced currently only for "POI Alert" feature, not for any kind of navigation/guiding

Sersus · April 06, 2014, 16:45:43

Meanwhile I am using this feature every time I ride the bike! And I would like to say a GREAT THANK for this voice supported navigation! I don't even know how to express my delight...

So I would like to offer another enhancement.
On the screenshot the red dotted line is the planned way with "medium" level of voices.

The purple line is the real passed way. The purple circle is the place where I tried to stop warning about the deviation from the route, but a single menu item "Nearest point" was hard redirect me to the red dot. And it was warning for about a 1 km of the way from the purple circle until the next point (purple down arrow).
Thus I think it would be a good idea to add a menu item for "Next point" (next waypoint).

Also it will be good to make an option to view the compass-oriented rotating arrow instead of route-fixed car during the navigation!

And thank you again for this type of navigation!

Menion · April 07, 2014, 21:43:07

Hello Sersus,

glad you like it. Whole idea is based on work of tommi and 0709 in this topic http://forum.locusmap.eu/index.php?topic=3372.0 , so big thanks belowns to them

Anyway
1) weird that locus do not correctly pointed you on next point on track. Add something like "Next point" is possible, but much better should be if all is automatical

2) you may try disable "Snap to track" in menu > settings > navigation . It should help with rotation of cursor and snapping to track during a ride

Sersus · August 06, 2014, 10:06:00

Do you plan to do the backward navigation along tracks?

tommi · August 06, 2014, 17:42:01

Backward navigation isn't actually necessary.
It would be sufficient to offer not only making a copy of a track but also a reverse copy of a track.

Sersus · August 06, 2014, 20:03:08

Thank you! Now I am using 3.1.3. I will be waiting when the test version (with ability to reverse tracks) to be released.

Bucky Kid · August 17, 2014, 21:18:34

Hello, I tested this feature today thoroughly with latest beta and I must say it's working fairly good. Good work

But I have one suggestion about voice navigation. For outdoor it comes too early (500m and 200m before turning point, then no more notifications). I propose to replace the notify 500m before by notify closely (10-20m) before turning point. The 200m before announce is good. Or can the notices be configured somewhere? This would be best

Also notify distances before turning depending on moving speed would be comfortable (the higher speed, the sooner the commands come)