Author Topic: MAP USAGE - SERVER OVERLOADING ...  (Read 17205 times)

Offline jusc

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Re: MAP USAGE - SERVER OVERLOADING ...
« Reply #15 on: May 08, 2011, 17:19:24 »
Online mode is already blocked for "Wanderreit"  :(
J.
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Offline femto

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Re: MAP USAGE - SERVER OVERLOADING ...
« Reply #16 on: May 08, 2011, 18:55:15 »
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Online mode is already blocked for "Wanderreit"  :(

This shows how dangerous the situation is currently for Locus and any other app which allows mass downloading of map tiles!

I agree with menion that adding a daily limit for downloading tiles is a good thing and I disagree strongly with everyone trying to fake the User Agent and any other tricks suggested. This won't make things better!

I also agree that the map providers should think about some sort of 'abo' which would allow the smartphone users to legally download tiles for offline use.
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Offline Hyperplane

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Re: MAP USAGE - SERVER OVERLOADING ...
« Reply #17 on: May 08, 2011, 19:37:00 »
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I also agree that the map providers should think about some sort of 'abo' which would allow the smartphone users to legally download tiles for offline use.

I concur. The best solution for all parties involved would be a subscription offered by the map providers allowing us to download a certain data/map volume within a  certain period of time. I would gladly pay a reasonable monthly or annual fee for this.
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Offline menion

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Re: MAP USAGE - SERVER OVERLOADING ...
« Reply #18 on: May 08, 2011, 20:13:31 »
you can check already published Locus version. Limit is already there and also all stuff that are needed for valid use of all included online maps. Bad news for all download maniacs ... limit is applied also on maps added by provider.xml file. Locus send valid HTTP user-agent and I don't want to get emails that Locus blocks any other servers ...

you can read simple post about it here ... http://locus.asamm.cz/?p=400
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Offline userloser

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Re: MAP USAGE - SERVER OVERLOADING ...
« Reply #19 on: May 09, 2011, 07:28:13 »
Actually, that is bad news for everyone, and especially for the responsible users of locus.
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Offline menion

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Re: MAP USAGE - SERVER OVERLOADING ...
« Reply #20 on: May 09, 2011, 07:46:32 »
Hmm I don't see it as a big problem. 25k tiles per day is very nice area don't you think? And also, you can download 25k today, 25k tomorrow, and so on and still on same map. So no problem at all. When you use some technique like download along path or around points, together with "zoom lock" button, I think that this is still very usable!
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Offline jusc

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Re: MAP USAGE - SERVER OVERLOADING ...
« Reply #21 on: May 09, 2011, 08:28:27 »
I agree with http://locus.asamm.cz/?p=400 and I just installed 1.7.3 with limitation etc. but the "Wanderreit is still blocked in online mode. So only "good will" self limitaion doesn´t help.
I propose to change user agent to Mozilla p. e, for online mode.
J.
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Offline menion

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Re: MAP USAGE - SERVER OVERLOADING ...
« Reply #22 on: May 09, 2011, 09:43:34 »
Nono, no changing of user-agent. Sorry. Also, this is I think temporary solution from owner of Wanderreit. I need to wait for a while until I'll contact him with some offer. Currently, the soil is too hot on my side ...
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Offline Minjin

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Re: MAP USAGE - SERVER OVERLOADING ...
« Reply #23 on: May 09, 2011, 14:33:17 »
I had the same problem will using Nonimapview (desktop app like MOBAC).

A good idea is to use a delay in ms for downloading tiles (200ms, 500ms, etc) in that way downloading big maps is longer but works fine and then less tiles are downloaded in same times.

Maybe you can try, first to add a delay and see what append. Why not q bigger delay for downloading whole maps and smeller in normal (online) mode.

I guess it is not too bad if a map is charged in 30min in place of 10min. Maybe the delay can vary in function of size of maps to create. Big map = bigger delay...

With delay, online mode will not be affected as we do not load a lot of tiles in short times...  :D
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Offline spawny

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Re: MAP USAGE - SERVER OVERLOADING ...
« Reply #24 on: May 31, 2011, 00:48:25 »
Hi Menion,
I just recognized the download limitation and understand it completely! However I have to complain about the zoom level, which is not suitable for cities in my opinion. Sometimes the names of the streets are not even visible or very hard to read on higher resolutions. I never downloaded more than 2000 tiles at once, which is good enough for the best parts of a town. I would appreciate it, if there only would be daily download limitation with full zoom. So far I had to install an old version of Locus to prepare a trip to some other place.

Anyway ... I really appreciate your hard work on that great program!
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Offline menion

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Re: MAP USAGE - SERVER OVERLOADING ...
« Reply #25 on: May 31, 2011, 05:49:39 »
hi spawny,
  I'm glad you understand. Limitation on zooms is from OSM Terms of usage, it's not my own decision. Anyway limit on last two zooms is applied only on classic OSM servers, but ArcGIS and Mapquest (and own maps) do not have limit on zooms! (if so, there is a mistake) :). So use some of alternative maps if you have problem with street reading ...
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Offline adrianTNT

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Re: MAP USAGE - SERVER OVERLOADING ...
« Reply #26 on: July 18, 2011, 14:24:39 »
Hello Menion, are you familiar with Amazon Web Services? Amazon Cloud Front to be more specific, I think it might be used to help/solve the downloads problem.

http://aws.amazon.com/cloudfront/

I will try to explain what it does shortly.

You can have a "source domain" (locus domain or map provider's domain) and Cloud Front can read from that domain and cache content to deliver it to users from different servers across globe.

You get a domain like afdsfafew3r43ewwarefw.cloudfront.net and then you can set a cleaner cname like cdn.asamm.cz that points to that long domain.

Whenever someone access a file like http://cdn.asamm.cz/tile.jpg they will get the file from your defined "source domain" like http://asamm.cz.tile.jpg but loaded from a server from USA/Japan/Europe, depending on user's location, file will not be loaded from your server anymore.

Now I am not sure how map providers domain and data works, it might or might not be compatible with this, but since system is very simple it might work nicely.
Traffic is 0.12$/GB and lower with more traffic. Maybe Amazon can somehow become a sponsor OR use this service only for PRO users OR get donations from users and use them to pay for this traffic OR maybe users can BUY gb from you, (0.15-0.20$/gb is not bad).
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Offline Chaos_99

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Re: MAP USAGE - SERVER OVERLOADING ...
« Reply #27 on: October 07, 2011, 12:17:46 »
Hi menion,

I just wanted to point out thet the mass downloading and server overloading problem just gone hot again in the OSM public blog.
Probably the same discussion is going on on the mailing list, but I don't follow that.

Seems that the server load is critical again and blocking external apps (stupid!) is a topic talked about. This will boil down to blocking mass download apps, but will still hit Locus.
Another view is that app developers should participate in hosting costs, at least if their apps are paid for. (Do you have donated to OSM recently? If so, you should make that public to strengthen your position.)

I'm trying to argue in favor of external apps and also mass downloading, which has its purpose and is a feature of OSM that I don't want to miss. But my voice doesn't count much.
Seems we have to find another solution in the long run. What about local offline rendering? Download vector data from OSM, render on your own PC and copy the tiles to Locus? (I haven't tried, but I think those Mapmaker tools just download tiles too, right?)

Well, just so you be informed,

Chaos
« Last Edit: October 07, 2011, 13:17:19 by Chaos_99 »
 

Offline menion

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Re: MAP USAGE - SERVER OVERLOADING ...
« Reply #28 on: October 07, 2011, 12:34:51 »
Hi Chaos,
  I know I know ... this topic is discuss here viewtopic.php?f=10&t=1166

  locus is currently blocked for some zoom layers without any notify to me and no warning even when all terms of use are valid. Yes I donated a few days ago not a small amount to cover some damage mainly few months ago. I'm trying as much to lower some downloading from servers (many maps to choose, now also direct vector map downloading from own server) but seems it's not enough ...
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Offline dreamteam

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Re: MAP USAGE - SERVER OVERLOADING ...
« Reply #29 on: October 10, 2011, 17:11:36 »
Please find enclosed a information concerning osm map downloading I found today @ heise - sorry it is german.

Allthough they are using osm maps there is a charge for the map downloading:

>Der Download eines Landes kostet als In-App-Kauf 2,39 Euro, ein Kontinent 5,99 Euro und die weltweiten Karten 9,99 Euro. Einmal gekaufte >Karten kann man löschen und erst bei Bedarf wieder installieren, um Platz zu sparen.


I think we all need to make a difference that "Free" does not mean "no cost", because the infrastructure to make downloads available is creating costs.

So I think having at the end of the day we need to consider that there is a difference for those who are willing to pay and getting therefore a dedicated donwload volume or speed and those who don´t want or cannot pay and have to wait than longer.

I do not believe that the app developer at the end of the day is the responsible person for paying that "fee" because than the developer only can average the costs and increase the app price therefore and this would be alos not fair for the users who do not have the need for an ongoing high download demand.

If something does not costs anything it has also no value for most of the people - I am not saying that this is something good, but it is reality. Only if the downloads are costing money people will think more carefully if they need it or not

Best regards,

dreamteam


10.10.2011 16:10

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